ERIC SIMMONS: Thanks, Tony. So just a little bit about myself, I guess, to set some context. My name is Eric Simmons. I'm the vice president of Risk Management with Helix Electric. We're a large national electrical contractor. We do work all across the United States from Hawaii to Washington, DC. So we've got a pretty diverse workforce out there distributed across the country, and it gives us the opportunity to interact with a lot of clients in a lot of different environments.
I've worked for the organization for about 20 years now. I actually started in an operational role. So I take a little different view on our safety programs and how they integrate into the company as a whole and look forward to sharing a little bit of that with you all today.
TONY MILITELLO: Thanks, Eric. Yeah, that's the perspective that you and I have shared, again, over the years. And it's certainly that perspective that really does bring that different operational focus to how safety impacts our operational risk. So very specifically to that, I'll just jump right into the questions here, talk a little bit about that. Talk a little bit about how your safety programs and other risk reduction programs have a direct impact on your operational risk.
ERIC SIMMONS: Sure. Thanks, Tony. So, I mean, I think the reality every company is going to tell you that they emphasize safety. And you hear lots of things thrown around out there that safety is our first priority and all of that. It becomes very apparent within a few minutes of walking on a typical job site whether that's actually the case or not.
And we think at Helix, one of the things that sets us apart is our safety performance more so than any slogans or catchphrases or fancy stickers we put on our hard hats. All of that stuff is great to drive those programs forward, but it's really how you apply it on the job site. And we take a little bit of a different twist perhaps with safety, just based on our experience through the years.
So our safety planning on a job really starts with procurement. We really start to look at the customer or the client. Who are we going to build this project for? Who are we going to build this project with? Who else is going to be there? What's the environment that it's going to be built in? And then we take a little bit of a reflective look and look at, what are our capabilities?
We want to make sure that we've got a client that we can be successful with. It's a project type where we've got some experience, and we know that we can go out there and perform. But we've also got to make sure that we can bring that team to the project and be successful. So that's really where safety starts for us, is on that procurement business development side much more so than when we've got boots on the ground.
Boots on the ground, now you're out there trying to do that daily plan, those PTPs, those JJs, whatever your program is, and that's great and vitally important. But if you found yourself on a project that's poorly managed or has a lot of conditions that you're not used to, you can already be backed up to the wall a little bit when you find yourself there.
TONY MILITELLO: And what are maybe one or two of the key areas that you find are the most risky in terms of the work that you do? Again, there's obviously high-hazard work, and that's obviously one particular area. But what might be some areas, in addition to that high-hazard work and how you're impacting that and how you're controlling that, what are some other risk areas that you have found to be really in need of attention and that pre-planning?
ERIC SIMMONS: So for us, given the nature of our work as an electrical contractor, when we talk about specific work with putting- or risk related to putting the work in place, electrical hazards are definitely at the top of the list. Our projects are becoming increasingly complex. We're seeing a lot more higher-voltage systems brought into projects now. So that high-voltage exposure that used to be contained within the utility world now is very often found in the buildings that we are building.
We've got switchgear systems that are double-ended, sometimes triple-ended, multiple sources of energy, multiple layers of redundancy. So that's getting very complex and requires a high degree of attention and pre-planning from, really, that project impetus. When we're figuring out how to route conduits, how to do everything else, you've got to understand how we're going to energize that building so that we can control that release of energy through.
The work environment is also just becoming more complex with other issues. We do that utility work, other than just on the job site. We go and do power line replacement, things like that, typically called hardening projects. We do that on a lot of military jobs, where we'll go replace overhead lines with underground distribution, so lots of excavation, and exposes us to a lot of interesting environmental hazards sometimes that other contractors might not face.
We recently had a project in Hawaii that we ended up discovering an area of the installation that had unexploded ordnance that the facility wasn't aware of, we encountered that. We encountered archeological remains, a lot of really interesting things that you can find there. We're also seeing in some parts of the country, more urbanized areas of the country, there's a lot more brownfield projects out there. So we're encountering sites that were previously used for other things and a lot of times have some contaminants in the soil.
I'm working on a project right now where we've discovered asbestos in backfill material, and we've got to figure out how to manage that and how we're going to go through and do excavation activities and install underground conduit and systems with this asbestos-containing material that was used for backfill off of a previous project. So safety is not just gloves and helmets, there's a lot more to it.
We really need to be diverse in our perspective and really look at a lot of things when we're trying to figure out how to execute these projects and protect our folks and protect the public and those around us.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah, thanks, Eric. One thing that's personally curious to me, obviously, operational risk can be directly impacted by schedule delays and the amount of need to hurry up and meet deadlines and schedules. Can you talk to me a little bit about how you're seeing supply chain and product delays? The electrical industry and the electrical utility industry is obviously not immune to those delays or those supply chain issues.
What are some of the things that you're finding unique that you need to manage to make sure that you're not being overly pressurized or you're not increasing the risk as a result of either construction delays or supply delays or other things that impact the schedule?
ERIC SIMMONS: For sure. So I think we're all feeling the impacts of these just general supply chain delays. It varies by the type of material that we're talking about. I can't speak for every trade out there, but I can tell you that the mechanical and electrical industries have been hugely impacted. So we've got multiple projects across the country where switchgear lead times that used to be 12 weeks are now 52 weeks or 60 weeks.
So we're building the entire building and then needing to figure out how we're going to get switchgear into it because we can't get the switchgear in and build rooms around it. So it's creating some unique challenges and a lot of opportunities, let's say, a lot of partnering opportunities with our general contractors and our other trade partners because we've got to look at how big the switchgear is. How are we going to move it in?
Is there still going to be a crane on site? Are we going to be trying to bring this in now through elevators? Are we going to have to leave out wall sections? How are we going to coordinate the installation of equipment that's sometimes huge? Some of our switchboards are tremendous. The generators that we're installing on our data center projects, they're the size of a semi trailer, really big equipment that now we're trying to move into partially completed or fully completed building shells.
It creates some unique challenges there from a logistics standpoint, but it also really creates some unique challenges for us because we still have to figure out how to get that building up and running to the highest degree possible. So in some instances, we're installing temporary switchgear. So now I'm going to have multiple exposures. I need to install a temporary piece of equipment, power it, do testing, get portions of the building up and running so that other aspects of the construction can continue.
And then at some point, that permanent switchgear is going to show up. Now we've got to coordinate outages, get that temporary switchgear out, put the new switchgear in, reconnect, re-energize. So really, some unique impacts have come out of and been borne by the supply chain impacts, just tremendous delays that you would never foresee before, like I said, five times what the normal lead time would be for some materials. So we're seeing those. We're seeing opportunities where we've got to go out and source alternate materials. We've got to find different ways to do the work because the schedule just can't sustain the delay to get the originally specified material.
So it's a lot of spitballing, throwing things at the wall, working with our customer, trying to understand what their ultimate goals are and the areas where they've got some flexibility, and then going and finding those solutions and bringing them back to that customer and trying to present some options so we can try to keep that project on track, continue to perform and execute that work with a high degree of safety, and deliver a high quality product, despite some of the challenges where we're building portions of buildings and then coming back rather than following a traditional construction schedule in a lot of areas.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah, thanks Eric. And some of those challenges are timeless, quite frankly. Your stories and the challenges that you just talked about today in 2024 hearken back to a couple of decades ago of nearly identical issues of a project where there was a delayed switchgear. And so we did exactly that. We had to build a room and then await for the switchgear's arrival. And the switchgear arrived only to be faced with a single leaf door, where it didn't fit.
ERIC SIMMONS: It happens.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah. So there's a reason for scheduling and planning out the work in a way that- there's a reason for that schedule. Talk a little bit about technology and innovation. Those are two words typically on the tips of people's tongue or certainly there's an insatiable thirst and appetite for. What are we doing with technology and innovation?
There's obviously a sense that innovation is the only way you're going to move forward. That's not always the case. Obviously, again, some of these things are timeless, but what are some things in technology and innovation space that you would consider- that you've taken on board to reduce risk across your organization?
ERIC SIMMONS: Yeah, I mean, we're hearing a lot of talk in the industry right now about technology, and it's really an interesting time. Traditionally, construction as a whole, as an industry, has been late to adopt a lot of technology. When you really look at it, we still have a lot of paper processes. We still do a lot of things in archaic ways compared to some industries that have really embraced technology.
That's starting to shift. We're really starting to see more technology come into construction and more purpose-built technology come into construction, which is really, really cool. You're seeing a lot of stuff right now directly related to safety. We're seeing robots on site. We've got layout robots that can go out there, so now you don't have to have somebody dragging a tape measure around, down on their hands and knees, snapping chalk lines or paint lines out on the floor to lay out walls is what the system is designed for.
But I'm seeing some contractors look at it to lay out overhead work, ductwork, recess cans, things like that are going to go in the ceiling. You can lay it out on the floor and laser it up and save a lot of those ergonomic exposures and just that labor-intensive, not super productive layout work. So that's tremendous. We're seeing the birth and really development of a lot of wearable technology, which is going to bring some really interesting advancements into the trade, wearables that can monitor ergonomic exposures. I'm really seeing a lot of them there.
We're seeing wearables that can help us to manage heat, which is, pardon the pun, a hot topic right now. We've got an OSHA National Emphasis Program on Heat. And it's becoming a more recognized hazard for construction workers across the country. There's some technology that now can help you monitor that in real time and understand what your employees are exposed to and how to better mitigate those exposures.
So there's some really cool stuff there. And just the digitization of all of these traditionally paper documents is allowing us to do a lot more in real time. It's allowing us to do a lot more coordination, which while you might not think of a direct safety aspect there, it's really huge. Speaking just for us and our experience, when we start looking at and really doing our analysis on incidents, a common factor in a lot of those incidents is rework.
We went in. We installed some work. We had to go back and modify it. Maybe we put it in the wrong spot. Maybe we use the wrong material. Or maybe there's a conflict with another trade. The work wasn't properly sequenced. We've got to take our work down so somebody else can install theirs, or we've got to move our work over so somebody else can fit in the space.
Regardless of the cause, that rework creates a lot of additional exposure. It now has tradespeople who know how to put the material in. That's what we're good at. I'm good at running conduit and pulling wire. I'm not nearly as good at pulling wire back out and taking conduit down. That's not our mainstay. So we're doing work where we have less experience, and it's just a lot more time in the field. It's a lot more exposure.
Now I'm handling that material two or three times. I've got more exposure to work at heights or all kinds of things. So this increased coordination that we're seeing is going to drive some of that out. And I think huge a secondary benefit there is going to be an increase in jobsite safety. I remember when I was still on the operational side of the business, we were really just getting into BIM coordination.
And we would spend lots and lots of time out there doing all of this BIM coordination, trying to understand where everybody's systems were going to fit in the space. And then all too often, I would end up out on the job building the job, and the other trades didn't even know that there was a model, and they'd just put their stuff wherever they put their stuff. It was back to the old system of whoever got there first got the best real estate, and everybody else got what was left. And we're fighting over corridor, ceiling spaces, and stuff like that.
That's starting to turn. Now I'm seeing everybody's got iPads now. Everybody's got tablet computers walking around on the jobsite. So that model is now out there, and we're doing a much better job of installing to that model, eliminating those clashes, reducing that rework, putting it in right the first time. So that's a huge technology improvement. For us, we're trying to move a lot of our safety processes into our project management system.
There's a lot of ways that you can go technology-wise. There's a lot of technology providers that are geared just towards safety. We went a little bit different route, and we're actually adapting our safety processes to go into our project management software, the thinking being that's the system that my project teams are going to be in all day, every day. It's going to create better visibility to those safety programs rather than having them over in their own system.
So that shift in processes is now allowing us a lot better visibility to our safety inspections. A lot of those jobsite processes that get done, we can see them in real time without needing to drive out to the job and looking in a three-ring binder and find a piece of paper. I can now dashboard some of those things through the power of BI and all of these new technologies.
I can pull that data out and harness big data and actually turn it into information and lets me get a better snapshot of the overall health of that project and lets me see where my risk is and where we need to go out and put some extra focus.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah, I really appreciate that, Eric. To use a bit of a cheeky analogy, your organization, any organization, but yours specifically, has a finite amount of energy and effort and voltage, for a lack of a better term, in all those things that you talked about. Not only are they reducing risk, but they're reducing resistance. So again, my mind goes immediately to Ohm's law.
There's a finite amount of voltage. And so the ability to get more current out of our workforce, out of our projects is by reducing resistance. It's a simple formula, as simple as the day is long. Let's change topics a little bit to talk about your leadership support. What are you seeing in terms of how the leadership of your organization is supporting the initiatives that you have in place currently and where you guys want to go in the future?
ERIC SIMMONS: For sure. So great question, Tony. I mean, this is a core foundational aspect of any successful program, is where's leadership in the process? What's their level of buy-in? And what are they doing in terms of messaging and support? Where we do it a little bit differently, I think, is in how we define that leadership. So at the executive level, I've got tremendous buy-in.
I'm blessed to be in an organization that we're second generation, privately held. The president that I work for has been affiliated with our company really since birth. So he grew up with everybody that's here. He's got this really high level of connectedness and caring for the people that work here, which really helps support all of my efforts.
They're really well received when I go say, hey, we need to spend a little money over here. We need to invest in a program over here, whatever. He is very bought into safety and to protecting the people that come and join Helix. So I've definitely got it there. I've got the support. I've got the resources. So really, where we see the rubber meet the road and really that huge payback is with that, the front-line leadership.
Executive leadership, incredibly important. They've got to be out there, setting the tone, providing the resources, and really demonstrating that they've got a commitment to supporting that safety program. But that front-line leader, for everybody on the jobsite, they represent the company. They're typically the highest level of management or leadership within the organization with which there's any regular impact.
So you can't fail to recognize the impact that that front-line leader has on setting the tone for the jobsite culture, providing the means and methods, really providing that instruction and oversight to everybody on the job. So it's really key that they're fully bought in to your safety processes. And that can take a little bit of effort because a lot of times, those front-line leaders, they've been in the industry for a while.
And the reality is our industry has changed tremendously, even in the last few years. It's been an interesting ride watching that as that's happened. So we've got a lot of those front-line leaders that sometimes they might be a little bit resistant to some of these things because they hearken back to the good old days when they didn't need to do that. We didn't need to wear gloves and whatever. And sometimes that can bleed over into their messaging and how they communicate.
So it's really, really important to spend a lot of time with that level of the organization and really make sure that they're bought in, they understand the why. We spend a lot of time there. When I transitioned into this role and took over our Safety Department, that was one of the big changes that we made. I didn't want to have all of these safety programs, just all these three-ring binders on the shelf that nobody read because it didn't really represent how we did the work. And people were resistant to try to integrate that into their day-to-day.
So we really went back. We streamlined all of that. And we spent a lot of time explaining the why. This is why this process exists. This is what we're trying to accomplish. And if you've got a suggestion on how to improve that, we are 100% open and receptive and want to have that feedback because the reality is the closer you are to the hazard, a lot of times, the better understanding of it you have and the better understanding you have of what solutions are really acceptable there.
So really engaging that front-line leadership, getting them bought into your programs where they believe in it and they communicate that belief to the tradespeople that are actually out there doing the work, that's huge, hugely impactful, and very, very important. So that's really where we spend a lot of time. We do a lot of training with that group. We do a lot of one-on-one interaction with that group.
I was just on a call right before this with one of our project managers talking through an issue that they were having. We try to really be there and be that support system to help that team accomplish their goals and to do it in a way that maintains our safety standards on that project.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah, great. Thanks, Eric. I've had experience with a senior leader that came into an organization that was associated with. And one of the first things that he did was exactly what you mentioned, which was made it crystal clear and a paramount discussion to have with all the field level leaders, the first-line supervisors, so whether that be foremen or superintendents or anybody that really represented a team lead or a first-line leader out in the field.
And for many of them, that was the first time that they had ever heard that there was an organizational expectation that they hold safety and risk reduction and risk management paramount to the organization's operations. And again, it was shocking to many of them. But as soon as they really saw that as their role or a principal role of theirs, the organization's risk reduction and, again, operations really made a tremendous shift obviously in a very positive direction.
So again, that's been my personal experience as well too, is to the extent that those first-line leaders have an appreciation for the fact that they have a critical role in leading the organization's safety and risk reduction measures, again, the rest of the organization follows suit, for sure. Any final comments that you have? Again, I've really enjoyed chatting with you and learning a little bit more about the products and the processes that you have there at Helix. But any comments that you want to add or anything that I forgot to ask?
ERIC SIMMONS: There's a lot of areas we could go with that, Tony. I just think I would encourage everybody to go out there and really look at these opportunities, see how you can move your safety processes forward. If we're trying to figure out how we're going to manage jobsite safety as we're mobilizing onto that job, I think you're missing a lot of opportunity.
I would just encourage people, really move that risk management process forward. Look at the jobs that you're building, where you're building them, clientele. And obviously, some of that depends on the economy. When we're in a project-rich environment and we can be more selective about who we work with and who we build with, obviously, it's easier to make those kind of decisions. It gets a little bit rougher when the economy is tighter.
But the reality is we've just seen so much of a payoff on that initial analysis of the project and the risk on the project. A little bit of planning and forethought in the beginning really helps us to select projects that are easier to build. We have better, safer outcomes that are more profitable. And it just saves a lot of wear and tear on everybody.
I think anybody that builds projects for a living- every job is going to have its rough spots. But we've all been on those jobs that were unnecessarily rough. They were poorly coordinated. They were poorly executed. Maybe they were behind schedule or there were budget constraints, things like that. And when you find yourself there, it really becomes much more difficult to maintain high safety standards.
A lot of companies start trying to cut corners. You've got staffing issues. You're in a scramble. Tensions are high, things like that. So through project selection, try to avoid those things. And then making sure you've got that good project plan to prevent you from getting there, I think, will pay dividends. If you wait to manage that safety issue until it's right in front of you, you really have a lot fewer options. So the quicker you can recognize it, the more mitigations you can put in place, really, the better options you have, the more economical it is.
And that proactive planning, another byproduct of it is it really demonstrates to your team members that you care about them and that you're invested in safety. It's not, hey, we're doing this because we have to. No, we're doing this because this is just how we do business. And that goes a long way. Creating that kind of a culture where people feel cared for and appreciated, and they know that the company has their back builds a lot of secondary benefits.
It generates a lot of loyalty in the organization. People really go the extra mile for you. They'll put in those extra hours when you need it. They'll go to that job that's maybe a little bit farther drive than they would like, but they're going to go there because they're committed to staying with the organization. And just huge paybacks, especially now as we find ourselves in a very interesting market.
We didn't talk about this specifically, but one of the other huge challenges right now is the skilled workforce shortage. There's not enough skilled people coming in the trade. We've got a lot of people exiting the trade. There's a departure of knowledge and skill with them. And so trying to build that team and keep those folks there, hugely important, more so than ever in today's economy. And one of the ways that you can do that is by really demonstrating to those employees that you're a different kind of organization and that you care about them and you're going to look out for them.
TONY MILITELLO: Yeah, thank you, Eric. Again, I really appreciate your time today and all that you do and your company does to help demonstrate leadership and commitment to our construction industry. Again, that is really insightful information that we're looking forward to sharing with our audience.
And with that, I'll turn it back to you, Max.
MAX NELSON: Thank you for listening to another episode of the podcast series dedicated to winners of the 2024 AGC Construction Safety Excellence Awards. We hope you are taking away insights that can be applied to your own programs and processes. For more information on the CSEA, visit www.agc.org/csea. If you found value in today's episode, don't forget to like and follow the show.
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